You are hereHome / Episode 40: Board Game at the End of the Universe
Episode 40: Board Game at the End of the Universe
| 40: Board Game at the End of the Universe Release Date: October 15, 2007 Running Time: 117 min. Listen Now: Download: Enhanced Version - MP3 Version Subscribe via iTunes: Enhanced - MP3 See sidebar for other subscription options |  |
Don't Panic. But get comfortable. Grab a Pan-Galactic Gargle Blaster from the bar settle in for our take on Twilight Imperium, a game of galactic conquest whose play time could be measured in light years.
News & Notes: Star Craft Swag, Game Prices, Utopia, Adam Spielt Closes
The List: Twilight Imperium
Name That Game: Win a copy of Ricochet Robots from Time Well Spent
Backshelf Spotlight: Master Labyrinth, Ricochet Robots
Truckloads of Goober: Abbey of the Wandering Books
Game Sommelier: Five game reprints to try or avoid
Mail Bag: World's Greatest Dice Roll
Complete Show Notes continue after the break.
Game News & Notes
Starcraft Swag Available at Local Game Stores Link
(Thanks to listener David Schuth for the info) When you pre-order StarCraft: the Board Game before Monday, October 22, 2007 through your Friendly Local Game Store or on the FFG Online Store, you can receive three high-quality art prints featuring images from the upcoming StarCraft 2 videogame: One 24" x 36" poster depicting a Terran Marine, and two 8-1/2" x 11" prints—one a Dark Templar, and the other showcasing scenery from the StarCraft universe.
Court Decision Influences Game Price Policies?
Listener Edmund Hack and I started a dicsussion along these lines after the last episode.What do you think? Read more in the forum.
Utopia Link
The rich king of Utopia invites princes from the greatest known civilizations (Persia, China, Maya, Greece and Egypt) to come to live in his city. Princes bring all the diversity of the architectural style of their civilization. As the King’s intendant, you are mandated to welcome and look after the princes who arrived at gates of the city. Each step of city construction gives you notoriety. The first player to reach 50 prestige points, ends the game and the player with the most points wins.
Adam Spielt Closing At the End of the Year Link
Adamspielt.de has been a great source for online game orders for those of us not lucky enough to live in Germany. The sad news is they have decided to discontinue the mail-order portion of their business at the end of 2007. They have been known for their excellent customer service and obsessive attention to packing every game with care. They are having a close-out sales to clear out their inventory, so you might want to check out adamspiel.de for some deals.
The List
Twilight Imperium BGG entry | Official Site
An epic empire-building game of intersteller conflict, trade, and struggle for power. Players take the roles of ancient galactic civilizations, each seeking to sieze the imperial throne via warfare, diplomacy, and technological progression.
Backshelf Spotlight
Mystery Connection Contest
Can you find a connection between these two games? We find a mystery connection each episode and challenge you, the listener, to hunt for it! Post your guesses to the Forum . Find the connection and you could win a pair of coveted custom Spiel Dice!
Congratulations AGAIN to Scooterb23 our winner for episode 39 ! Most creative guess also earns a set of dice this week, so congrats go to Splusmer, too!
Master Labyrinth Link
Navigate your pawn to collect various spell ingedients in a shifting maze made of tiles.
Ricochet Robots Link
It's a puzzle... it's a game... it's both! Use four robots and walls on a factory floor to find the shortest path to guide a 'bot to its target.
Truckloads of Goober
Abbey of the Wandering Books BGG Entry | Official site
The most expensive goober game ever featured. There are only 200 copies of the game in existence and each goes for 2,600 Euros or $3,100! Hand carved pieces, hand painted board, gold inlaid wooden letter holders. Thanks to Christof von Zadel from Dresden for bringing this game to our attention!
Game Sommelier
The Challenge: find five reprints of classic games that are either greatly improved by being updated or totally ruined by unnecessary changes.
Dave's List | Stephen's Vote |
| Winner's Circle (improved) | Thumbs Up |
| Robo Rally (ruined) | Thumbs Up |
| Titan: The Arena (improved) | Thumbs Up |
| Cosmic Encounter (ruined) | Thumbs Up |
| Acquire (improved) | Thumbs Up |
Next Challenge: A reprise of the last challenge! A do/don't list for game expansions. Make a list of five game expansions that are worthy additions or ruin the original.
Mail Bag
New donor to The Spiel!
"Five Card " Nancy Pogel
Listener Hans Van der Drift (Brisbane Australia) brought this to our attention:
The World's Greatest dice roll ! Helicopters, dice the size of a truck and a mountain in Greenland. Check out the Forum post with the video!
Kevin Rohrer wanted us to know about LAGcon in Louisville, KY November 9-11 details are available on our forums .
Marrku Jaatinen from Finland weighs in with some good advice for Dave's romantic Game Sommelier pics from way back in February: Summer Time and Flowerpower .
Andrew Rustleund writes in to say we are messing with his head. "Every time I heard the Truckloads of Goober intro, when I hear "you can't judge a book by its...", instead of filling it in with "cover", I always hear "goober". You can't judge a book by its goober. (If you listen past the end music you'll hear Dave saying it, too! It took Dave six tries NOT to say it. Heh!)
Tim Phelps writes: "I noticed a rules goof you guys made when playing Fire and Axe. When you raid a town, you can only make up to 3 attempts. If those all fail, then you have to wait until your next turn to try again with any remaining crew members you may have."
Errata
Could we say "without further ado" more times in this show? I don't think so...
Here's a recipe for a Pan-Galactic Gargle Blaster.
I'm sure there are some other goofs in there somewhere. Let us know if (when?) you find one!
I've played 4 full games now, and TI3 is a really solid game. Especially with people who know what they're doing, it is an absolute blast. Play time doesn't necessarily drop with more experience, however, because the more you understand about the game the more time it takes to evaluate and plan your actions. Oh, and there's also a lot more time dedicated to "diplomacy" as well. The thing I like most is that the game really builds a story (like all good "epic" games should). Unlike many ry, themeless eurogames, a good session of TI3 leaves behind memories and stories that can be remembered and discussed for months and years. It's like watching a good movie or reading a good book, except that the players are all partially responsible for the action! As far as the "Imperial" strategy card debacle, that's all fixed with the Shattered Empires expansion. For me, however, the endgame is still the game's one primary weak spot. The nature of the whole objectives/victory point winning condition drives the game to feel very artificial (where the races are all scrambling to accomplish these goals that may have nothing to do with what the race "should" really want to do), and it promotes strategies where races exhaust all their resources to push for the final few points, only to be left with a terrible board position but winning the game. There's just something wrong when a person wins a big space opera game but only controls a few systems and has only a few surviving ships left...
Thanks for the feedback from some Twilight Imperium fans' perspectives. We strive not to preach from on high and try not to tell anyone whether they should like a game or not. We'll certainly give you our opinions, but they're just that two dorks' opinions. We always want to err on the side of giving you a very good sense of the game and from there you can make your own judgements about whether it appeals to you or not.
That said, I think we gave ample warning that our rundown of TI would not be for the faint of heart. Even though we can be big windbags on almost any subject, this was certainly not our typical List sgement! At least with the enhanced version's chapter breaks, you can skip past any segment that induces slumber. I never thought of The Spiel as a sleep aid! The Spiel.. it's a desert topping AND an instant nap all in one!
It is precisely because there are so many things to keep track of that I think Twilight Imperium would be much better suited as a turn based computer game. Face to face trying to sift through all the different options and decisions can be very daunting even for someone who has played a few times. Having a computer version that can spell out all your given options in a very concise interface would really streamline the experience. For this reason, I could see play by email games being a sort of compromise. You have plenty of time to figure out and weigh your options in a pbem game.
I also get what you're saying, GamerChris, about the narrative aspect of the game being the most compelling part about TI. The problem for me is that the story of each game happens despite many of the rules and mechanics and not because of them. In each game I have played I always find myself wanting the politics and diplomacy to have a larger real impact on the outcome of the game and they rarely have. The interesting and memorable stories always seem like asides while the main action of the game takes a very predictable and anti-climactic path. It would be fun to see a space opera type game where the politics and diplomacy actually trump military conquest.
What do you all think?
Good to hear from you, Gavin. Hope things at Robot Martini are going well.
I can see how providing promo material that is useable in the actual game can certainly be a good way to bring out some extra support to local brick and mortar game stores. Just as Gamer Chris said, the extra figs for BattleLore definitely added value to the game and could easily make it worth the trip to the store. A few posters for a related computer game (StarCraft), doesn't really seem like incentive to me.
My main point is I don't think promo incentives should or need to be coupled with preferential price treatment. In other words, there are ways for game publishers to show Friendly Local Game Stores (FLGS) some love that don't end up raising game prices for consumers across the board.
There are two issues at play here.
1. Local game stores have to find new ways of doing business to stay in business because competition from online ventures is not going to go away.
2. Some game publishers are inching toward a two-tiered pricing system prejudicing brick and mortar business over online ones.
I don't think issue #2 is the salvation or solution to issue #1.
As for pre-orders giving a publisher a better idea of demand, that information is only accurate (and therefore useful) if you allow pre-orders from all forms of business (onlilne AND brick and mortar). There are many places without a local game store and gamers in those areas would be excluded if pre-orders are only allowed or counted from brick and mortar stores.
I have quite a few years experience working in a local brick and mortar game store, so I definitely understand how great a resource they can be in supporting interest in games. I just think the whole price fixing issue could very well be a boondoggle for local stores and will take time and energy away from coming up with other ways to branch out and find new ways to serve people.
It's Scotty's Matrix and we're just livin' in it... I wonder who that makes Morpheus and Neo? And don't forget Trinity...
At the end of the day, we're just glad to be a part of the hive mind, two voices in the conversation. I suppose there is some saturation point, but in general I think a greater variety of opinions and insights out there is valuable.
Our motivation for doing the show is tied in part to the idea that we bring a different perspective to games than many others. The fact that the show can take its place in the hive mind as part of a greater conversation is cool.
But at the same time our main goal is simple: stay true to our own voice. We can't worry too much about the ebb and flow of the other great voices out there. It's a chorus not a competition. And we'll do our part to stay on key.
Forgot to enable comments for this post. Whoops!
They are enabled now, so post away!
Stephen